Race, language and the word ‘negro’ in Brazil.
I’ve been wanting to write something about race in Brazil for a while. There have been quite a few things floating around in my head on the subject because there are so many differences between the UK and Brazil: history, population demographics, language and attitudes. So, it’s been on my ‘To Do’ list for a while and then recent events in England made me think again about the situation here in Brazil.
Left, Patrice Evra for Manchester United; Right, Luis Suárez for Liverpool.
Back in October last year, England’s two most successful football clubs, Liverpool and Manchester United, played each other. During the match Uruguayan Luis Suárez racially abused the French footballer, Patrice Evra. It went to some kind of a trial where various people gave evidence and the outcome was that Suárez was found guilty, fined and banned for 8 matches. The whole thing blew up again on Saturday when the two players met for the first time since the incident and Suárez refused to shake Evra’s hand.
One of the key issues during the trial was related to the meaning of the word “negro” in Uruguayan Spanish. As I understand it, Suárez admitted to using this term but claimed that he used it in a friendly manner. A lot has already been written on this, and by better people than me, so I won’t go into it any further, but it got me thinking again about and language and attitudes to race here in Brazil.
In England (and all English speaking countries as far as I’m aware), the use of the word negro to describe a black person is seen as deeply offensive. Yet in Spanish it is the word for the colour black (though that doesn’t exclude it from being used as an offensive racial term as far as I can tell). Here in Brazil, the most common word for the colour black is preto, though the dictionary also lists the word negro.
What really got me thinking about this was something that happened to me a few days ago. I was in a shop getting some documents scanned. A young (and extremely chatty!) black girl was helping me do all the scanning and since it was taking ages, we started discussing all kinds of things including my new job in Barra. She said she didn’t like Barra because the people there were stuck up (snobbish) and didn’t like black people. I’m not going to comment on whether this is true, except to say that I know 2 or 3 people who live in Barra and they don’t seem to be racist at all.
Anyway, the point is that the word she used to refer to black people was negras (the feminised, pluralised version of negro). I asked around and it’s a slightly complicated situation but negro certainly isn’t, by definition, an offensive word.
In England we often use the term ‘black’, even when someone’s skin isn’t particularly dark. But when I made a reference to one of my wife’s friends being black, she (my wife) corrected me, saying “She’s not black, she’s morena“. This word morena (moreno for a guy) seems to cover a lot of people who are somewhere between white and black – you have to be really quite dark skinned here to qualify for black. There is also the term mulato which apparently means medium brown skin but with traditionally ‘black’ features.
It got me thinking again about the differences between the Brazilians and the British. Would Rio Ferdinand, another Manchester United footballer and vocal anti-racism campaigner, be referred to as black here in Brazil? How are attitudes to race different in Brazil compared to Britain and what caused did those differences arise?
Lots more to think about but as this post is starting to sprawl, I’ll stop here and continue on this subject in my next post.
Negro é o substantivo politicamento correto em português para se referir a “afro-descendentes”, preto é usado também, mas pode ser considerado ofensivo.
Rio Ferdinand com certeza seria considerado moreno.
Algumas pessoas dizem que chamar alguém de mulato, moreno ou qualquer outra variação, é negar a origem negra. Na minha opinião, chamar um mulato de negro, seria negar a origem branca, afinal, somos todos mestiços no Brasil.
Olá Elaine, é uma questão interessante e complicado né? Nomes (ou ‘rótulos’?) tém significados diferentes para pessoas diferentes. Eu sei que não são soluções facíl, mas acho que uma educação melhor para todos seria melhorar muitas coisas no Brasil. Obrigado pelo seu comentário :)
I was about to write a post about this… :-)
Salvador has the highest proportion of negros in Brazil, and I can tell you that negro is not offensive, but preto is (it’s generally used for things, not people – for example, uma camisa preta).
Bahia has a black pride movement, so it’s a little more common here for people to self-identify as negro as opposed to moreno (whereas in Fortaleza, I heard a VERY dark woman say she’s not black, she’s morena – like your wife’s friend)
However, in contrast, even in a city with such a high proportion (something like 85%) of afro-descendentes, there is a huge class dynamic at play. The rich are overwhelmingly lighter skinned, and the poor overwhelmingly darker… and thus more frequently involved in crime, drugs, etc. This can make some people shy away from self-identifying as negro since they don’t want to associate themselves with “those” types of people.
My husband has three black grandparents, yet has fairly light skin and identifies as pardo (yet another term for “mixed”) – yet also as negro. One of his brothers is much darker. The other is quite a bit lighter. It’s complicated. Gotta love Brazilian genetics!
It’s such a big, sprawling subject, I hope this doesn’t stop you writing your post – I’d love to hear your take on it!
You raise some very interesting points – both you and Elaine mention that ‘preto’ can be offensive, so I was surprised to see the official census using that term for black people. I wonder if that is the government being out of touch?
Also, some people only use “white” to describe those who have VERY predominant European ancestry (light hair, light eyes). My husband has said things like “the only true white people in Brazil are in the south, where they have the German and Dutch colonies. Everyone else is mixed to some degree, although many would like to claim otherwise.” So even someone with skin about the same tone as mine – but who has brown eyes as opposed to my blue – could be called “pardo.”
Don’t worry – I still have a post on race in Brazil brewing that I think you’ll find interesting ;-)
I was wondering about that this past weekend. It seems that people here didn’t figure out a better term between black and white to define someone who is slighty darkened skin. Anyway, speaking of this race issue, I was fascinated to find out that in the UK ‘asian people’ is meant to be use specifically for Pakistani/ Indian populations, whereas in Brazil is simply a broader term for Japanese/ Chinese/ East Asians in general. It was a bit amusing when I explained that to Uni friends. They asked the obvious question: ‘So how do you call people from India and Pakistan in Brazil, taking into consideration that they are also Asians?’. ‘We don’t call them anything, we simply ignore them’, was my not so politically correct (though a bit accurate I must say) answer..
Hey Gustavo,
It’s true! I don’t know about Rio Ferdinand’s family tree, but it certainly looks like he has a mix of black and white ancestors doesn’t it? Yet I’m pretty sure he would refer to himself as black. I have a couple of friends who have parents who originate from different parts of the world and they call themselves ‘halfies’ (as in half-caste). They say it with a smile, in a light-hearted way and of course they can call themselves what they want, but I think I’d feel a bit uncomfortable using that term to describe someone else…
The ‘Asian’ label is interesting. As you say, we use it for people from the Subcontinent (Pakistan, India, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka). I believe Australia and NZ are much like you, using the term to refer to South-East Asians (Thailand, Vietnam, etc and, I think, Chinese and Japanese too). Asia is such a big place, I guess we are all using the term to refer to the most populous immigrant communities in our country.
Olá Tom,
eu não diria que o mais comum no Brasil é o termo preto para designar alquém de cor escura. Eu vejo ambos termos sendo usados, tanto preto como negro. Existe uma escala de cinza no meio, porque no Brasil a miscigenação sempre foi muito grande com todas a raças.
É difícil para um brasileiro se classificar racialmente, devido a enorme mistura. Sendo mulato ou moreno, implica dizer que se tem caracteríticas negras e brancas. É POSSÍVEL NEGAR UMA RAÇA EM PREJUÍZO DA OUTRA?
Muitas vezes, o que vai determinar se esses termos são preconceituosos ou não, é o tom de voz, a arrogância com que é falado, linguagem corporal, ou conduta diferente em determinados lugares para brancos e negros.
O preconceito existe em todas as partes do mundo, inclusive no Brasil. Mas diferente de outros lugares é possível perceber tolerância aqui. Pode- se ver casais multirraciais com uma certa frequência, e em quase todas as classes sociais.
Repito, não quer dizer que não haja preconceito, mas há sim TOLERÂNCIA na minha opinião.
Além disso, por motivos históricos e má distribuição de renda, percebe- se diferenças sociais, que atingem aos negros em maioria, mas também alcança índios e até brancos .
As mudanças econômicas e sociais atuais devem mudar o rumo dessa história num médio e longo prazo. Há muito o que fazer, e é dever e objetivo do Brasil diminuir essas diferenças.
Com relação ao futebol, vou lhe contar uma curiosidade do futebol sulamericano que talvez lhe ajude a entender o comportamento do jogador uruguaio Suáres.
É muito comum joagadores argentinos e uruguaios serem preconceituosos( eu usarei esse termo sim ) com outros jogadores negros.
Quando eles jogam contra clubes brasileiros de futebol, em que existem muitos negros, é frequente eles chamarem aos atletas brasileiros, de macacos, macaquinhos e negros de merda, dentre outras coisas, que não são de uma forma carinhosa ou amigável.
Por razões históricas e imigratórias, Argentina e Uruguai praticamente não possuem negros.
Os poucos pretos que um dia existiram foram dizimados ou mortos por doenças ou guerras. E depois, com a migração de italianos, espanhois e outros europeus para esses países, a população deles é predominantemente branca. O comportamento do Suáres é um pouco do reflexo daquilo que ocorre nos campos sulamericanos.
Para terminar, existe uma piada sobre os argentinos, que descreve um pouco do que eles pensam de si mesmos:
” O argentino é o italiano que fala espanhol, e pensa que é inglês” rs
Desculpe ter sido tão longa. Não sou dona da verdade. Apenas descrevi o que eu vejo e sinto.
Abraços!
Ah ha ha! Que bom seu comentário, Rose! Ja conheco uma dona da verdade (minha mulher) então estou feliz que você não é também – uma é bastante! rs!
Gostei muito sua palavras porque foram interesante, inteligente and como uma aula de português também! rs!
Acho que você ta certa – palvras são poderoso, mas são as intenções por trás das palavras que podem fazer o dano. Muito interessante, todo disso, Abraços!
As most have said here, I’ve heard the term “negro” being used freely and without any type of hesitation, which leads me to believe that it is not an offensive term.
I think it’s interesting that you consider Rio Ferdinand to be black, as I would probably never think of him as being that. To me, he looks Hispanic or Latino from some country in Middle of Northern South America. Where is he from anyway? He could be Venezuelan or Colombian in my opinion (and a lot of other things.)
I think the terms Pardo and Moreno are very confusing as I’ve heard blatantly white people with dark hair being referred to as Morenos, and I’ve seen people being referred to as Pardo when they actually seem white to me.
One thing that is not confusing however is the classifications of “Brancos” e “Negros.” It seems that when people are called black, they would pass for black in the USA and when they are white they would pass as white in the USA.
My two cents!!
Hmmm, I really want to find out about his ancestry now, but I’m pretty sure that he is a mix of white and Afro-Caribbean. If I had never heard of nor seen him before, I’m not sure I would know exactly what to call him because he doesn’t have very dark skin or typical sub-saharan African features. But I’m fairly sure he would describe himself as black, so that’s what I go with! :)
You got it right, Alex.
Yup, in Brazil “negro” is the correct term while “preto” is frowned upon and can be considered racist. “Moreno” is a tricky one because it also translates as “brunette”. It can be used to describe a wide spectrum of people ranging from pasty white (with dark hair) all the way to someone who could also be described as black. Because it’s so non-committal it’s when you want to describe (vaguely) someone’s appearance while avoiding a long debate on racial issues.
In South Brazil usually a Loiro/a is a blonde, a Moreno/a is a caucasian brunette, and a Negro/a refers to a black person.
I can understand people wanting a non-committal term. When you don’t know what label someone uses for themselves, it can be tricky if you think that getting it wrong might cause offence.
Tom,
– I think it’s interesting that Suarez would not be considered White in the United States, nor in Northern Europe. The judge who heard the case must have been somewhat puzzled. I’m not saying that only whites can be racists; but it’s usually the case when these events come to light.
– When encountering a chatterbox, yet seeking silence, strike up a conversation about your herb garden. I use my stamp collection for such situations and it works like a charm, on Asians, Whites, Blacks, Catholics, Jews . . .
Btw doesn’t Rio Ferdinand kind of look like Jeremy Irons?
http://www.celebs101.com/gallery/Jeremy_Irons/199584/Jeremy_Irons_8.jpg
I have no idea what you mean about my herb garden – surely that would just pull even more people into the conversation?! “Hey, what’s that you’re saying about Thyme? I find my grows best if I water it every other day…” – before you know it there’d be a herb-based riot in the scanning shop!
Jeremy Irons and Rio Ferdinand – I see what you mean. They both have heads for a start ;) No, I do see what you mean really – similar noses for sure. It is actually quite hard to find a shot of Rio in which he doesn’t look deeply confused – this was the best I could do.
“It is actually quite hard to find a shot of Rio in which he doesn’t look deeply confused – this was the best I could do”
Just search for pictures of him off the pitch.
Tom,
Neither “Preto” or “Negro” are offensive in Brazilian Portuguese. But they can be depending on the rest of your sentence, depending in what context the words are used, and above all depending on your tone of voice.
Actually, you can go to jail if found guilty of a “crime of racism” in Brazil and calling someone a “Negro” or a “Preto” in a derrogatory manner can land you in jail. Yes, you heard me right, J A I L !!!!
To be on the safe side, I would always use the term “Afro Descendente”, end of story.
These terms are those kind of things, it depends who says it, how it is said and to who it is said to!
Blacks speaking among blacks, no problem. Whites speaking about blacks or to blacks, might want to be on the safe side and use the “politically correct” term “Afro Descendente”.
Abracos Tom
Otimo post
:)
Ray
Tom,
I just remembered an example to give you about going to jail for commiting a crime of racism in Brazil:
A “Afro Descedente” maid was caught steeling from the house she worked for, the white homeowner was very upset and in the heat of the moment called her maid a “Negra Suja”, “Dirty Black”. BAM!
JAIL!! No mercy, no ifs or buts…
The irony is that the black maid stole something and wasn’t punished for her crime, but the homeowner went to jail for something she said, which is considered a crime of racism in Brazil.
Ray
Hi Ray,
Thanks for this – now that you’ve mentioned it, I remember my wife telling me about that law some time ago (annoying that I didn’t remember it when I was writing the post!! Argh! My memory is failing! ;) ).
I wonder how strong the punishments are in other countries – my guess is that in the UK someone in the same example would probably just receive a fine. I’m not defending for one second the use of that kind of abusive language, but I think that the law should take into account a difference between a spontaneous outburst and someone who has time to think about what they’re saying. The woman in this hideous and shameful example went to prison.
Abraço, Tom
its better calling black people negro in brazil. calling them preto is not polite.
I wonder if this has ever caused a language-confusion issue, where a black person from an English speaking country has been in Brazil and heard the term “negro” used and taken offence… I know the pronunciation is different, but still, it doesn’t sound impossible does it?
The word negro is weird in Argentina/Uruguay, people use it all the time to say something is bad or ugly but if you ask them about it they’ll invariably tell you that the term has nothing to do with race. Once I was told, “it’s not racist because we don’t have Black people here”, and although that sounds ridiculous for me, I do think that they don’t think about the word the way we do. That said, it was my experience that Argentines are pretty damn racist…just not towards people of African descent (cause there aren’t any, and the few that are are treated as if they were exotic). I’m not defending what the dude said, I’m just saying that soccer players would say “un negro de mierda” about anyone, regardless of race, and that it is different, I think, than what a commenter said above about calling Brazilians macacos, which is just straight up ridiculous and offensive. Btw, in the states when we say Asians it is almost always to refer to Chinese/Japanese/Korean/Southeast Asian. Indians are normally just called Indians. No idea why, probably because mass Chinese/Japanese immigration is much older in the states than Indian immigration.
Chinese in American is SO old, the FIRST anti-immigrations laws were created.
First law ever to deal with immigration was the PAGE ACT.
to judge from his looks, Rio Ferdinand is a mulato. He has a whitish skin and definitely black traits..
Many years ago, when I was growing up in Brazil, both terms, preto and negro were more than words designating races, they were derogatory, as was mulato. With the passage of time, attitudes softened and blacks with some European in them began to be referred to as morenos. That is not right, as moreno has always designated a white dark-haired person (read Alex’s comment above). Surprisingly, negro has been opted as the acceptable term for blacks.
P.S. Pardo is the same as mulato.