Who wants to be a Brazilian?
I want to start by saying that I really love Brazil and Brazilians. Brazil is a beautiful and diverse country and if I had to characterise Brazilians, I would say that they were kind, warm, hard-working and thoughtful people. Of course Brazil has its fair share of problems, and not every Brazilian is kind, warm, thoughtful, but I think Brazilians have plenty to be proud of.
Ordem e Progresso – the motto on Brazil’s excellent flag.
I wanted to make that clear because I don’t want the rest of this post to be mistaken for being somehow anti-Brazilian. With that out of the way, let’s continue!
A few weeks ago I finally received my official Brazilian ID card for foreigners (RNE – Registro Nacional de Estrangeiros). It was a great moment, the culmination of 2 years of filling in forms, making visits to the Federal Police and waiting – with the arrival of my ID card I was finally an official resident of Brazil! When I mentioned this to friends and colleagues, several people asked if I would now go on to seek Brazilian citizenship. This got me thinking – do I actually want to become Brazilian?
To be honest, I haven’t done much research into the benefits of citizenship over permanent residency, but I guess there must be a few (voting, various other rights and governmental safeguards, etc). But with my current status (resident) I can work and I can come and go without needing to apply for additional visas – life seems pretty good!
As well as thinking about this question in practical terms, I started thinking about it in more personal terms. I find Brazil fascinating and stimulating, but every day I see and hear things that remind me that I am very different to most Brazilians. I’m not just talking about the language when I say that Brazilians communicate in a very different way to me (loudly!), they have different eating habits (long lunches) and different working styles (those long lunches and extra breaks mean that they work really long hours).
I certainly don’t feel superior to Brazilians, but I do feel different. Compared to the average Brazilian I’m fairly reserved, I stress about things and I’m a terrible dancer (these three go together naturally don’t you think?). But despite my many failings (false modesty among them) the bottom line is that I’m happy being English.
Brazil – football crazy!
On the football pitch (that arena of national pride so important to both countries), the English hold Brazilians in high esteem. If an English club team are playing amazingly well, English supporters sing “It’s just like watching Brazil” to the tune of ‘Blue Moon’. To my delight, England beat Brazil when the two teams met on Wednesday and Frank Lampard scored the kind of goal that could have Brazilians singing “It’s just like watching England” (calm down, just kidding…).
When I first arrived in Brazil, the World Cup 2010 was in full swing. In a fit of patriotism, I bought these Havianas. England were knocked out the next day…
I’m very much in favour of integration and would love it if some ‘Brazilianness’ rubbed off on me, but as I went home after the game on Wednesday I realised I was quietly content with my own nationality, just as I expect Brazilians are with theirs.
Do you think ex-pats have a responsibility to ‘go native’? Would you consider taking citizenship of a country you had moved to?
I don’t think there should be any responsibility to “go native”. Being a foreign national with full residency rights is perfectly fine. Of course, you might choose at some point to naturalize, either for practical reasons (access to public sector jobs?) or personal ones (I don’t know, one day you wake up and feel more Brazilian). These days governments are more clued up on dual citizenship anyway so there are few downsides to having a second nationality.
The only downside I can think of would be if I got involved in a football match back in England. The weight of expectation would be tremendous! ;)
I would only consider taking citizenship in a different country if I had moved there with the intent of never living in my native country again. And the only circumstances that I can think of under which that would happen would be if the political situation in the US became so toxic that I had chosen to emigrate permanently. Otherwise, permanent residency status seems like the best way to go.
Phil, I feel the same way – I don’t know for sure that I’ll definitely live in Brazil for the rest of my life. And right now I still feel very English. Who knows though, maybe if I became a Brazilian citizen that might nudge me into feeling more Brazilian.
As far as I remember the Brazilian Constitution lets foreigners acquire Brazilian citizenship only after 15 years of permanent residence there (except for citizens of Portuguese speaking countries where only one year is required). But perhaps I am not right or my information is not up-to-date. What do you know about this?
Hi Akos! Good to see you commenting on the blog! :D
I heard that if you’re married to a Brazilian citizen then you only have to wait a year, but I really haven’t done a lot of research on this so I could be wrong. 15 years is a long wait isn’t it?! If I had to wait 15 years for anything I would have one big old party to celebrate!
Having lived in France for 7 years, I have never really thought of getting French citizenship. Probably for the same reasons both you and Phil listed. Instead, I kept renewing my “Carte de Séjour” every year (which can be a painful experience in the “Prefecture”, specially in Nice/Fr). Recently though, I took dual citizenship Brazilian/Portuguese (I have Portuguese ascendents), though never making real use of it. That would surely have saved me some time in the French “Préfectures”. :-)
One problem regarding permanent residency is that, depending on the country of residency, you can actually lose it if not staying physically in that country for a given period. That’s the case for Canada. When you get the PR card you’ll have to renew it every 5 years, but in order to be eligible to do it, you’ll have to physically stay there for a 2 year period (not necessarily contiguous days). There are exceptions, like when you work for a Canadian company abroad, but in general it’s how it works.
Being Brazilian, I don’t know really how that works here. But if it expires, that could maybe be a good reason to acquire it.
Cheers,
Hey Mauricio – good point! We have no plans to leave, but there’s a chance that one day Mrs Eat Rio and I might want to move abroad for a bit. The idea of having to go through this whole process again is almost unbearable!
I have an european and a brazilian passport. its very convenient to travel and I feel like a citizen in both countries.
Interesting – a few people have mentioned that getting citizenship made them feel more of a citizen, more integrated, etc. Maybe I should try it!
Tom,
Mauricio makes a good point! The permanent residency status is conditional of your permanence in Brazil, if you become a citizen no one will ever be able to take that away from you.
Regarding the comment above posted by AKOS, there is a small correction to be made, not ALL PORTUGUESE LANGUAGE countries, only citizens from Portugal have that privilege.
You are correct, being married to a Brazilian you get your citizenship right away, the 15 years Akos mentioned are for illegal immigrants who enter in a path to become citizens, Lula created that a few years ago, in an effort to curb abuse on illegal immigrants from the part of sweat shop owners.
Ok, picture the following scenario: You are in a tour, somewhere in the world, in a bus, boat or airplane, and terrorist take over said bus, boat/airplane and announce on the speaker phone: We are now going to kill all Americans, British and Israeli on this boat/bus/plane, Brazilians, Mexicans and Canadians can relax, you are good to go… ok, people, let’s pull out your passports and show us your nationalities… I bet in that exact moment, you would be greatly relieved to have two passports, a British one and a Brazilian one… Come on Tom, join us!! What do you have to loose!!!
Whatever you end up deciding to do, I can assure you, Brazil will be lucky for having you as a citizen!! :)
Abracos
Ray
The problem with said scenario is that Tom would be too reserved to mention his Brazilian nationality to the terrorist. Don’t get me wrong: he would remove his Brazilian passaport from his jacket to save himself; but then he wouldn’t want to inconvenience the person sitting next to him by intruding upon their personal air space when handing the passport over to the delinquent taking over the airplane. This is a fact since he would certainly be sitting in the middle seat (after giving up his original aisle or window seat to an old lady or some chap claiming to suffer from acute mid row claustrophobia).
On a side note: what a save from that English goalkeeper, and it is also good to see Brazilian keeper Julio Cesar back in top form.
Ray’s scenario is spot on, that happens *all* the time.
Now Tom, don’t forget to check the terrorists’ actual policy on dual nationality hostages before your run-in with them. The last thing you need is to find out that your Brazilian passport isn’t the Get Out Of Jail Free card you thought it was. Have a look at their website and read the fine print carefully to make sure you are dealing with a legitimate organization. It sounds crazy but some terrorist groups out there don’t have any written guidelines or policies on basic operations like killing hostages. I know, the mind boggles…
(Oops, that’s strange, why is this sarcasm switch turned on? Nevermind, it’s probably nothing.)
Ha ha! Thanks Ray! I would be very honoured to join the club! :)
@Gritty, speaking of fine saves by English goalkeepers, this is the one that I always sticks in my mind. Not sure it’s really “the greatest save in history”, but it was impressive and I bet Pelé really did think he’d scored… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngE9RCAdWaE
@Andrew – ha ha! I know you’re joking, but I heard quite a few stories about people of various nationalities being treated very differently according to passport. I remember hearing that Colombian terrorists would customarily stop buses and rob everyone, but would look out for Israeli backpackers because they knew how to service guns (because of their national service). The story (apocryphal I’m sure) goes that the Israeli kids would help fix up the terrorists guns and in return would not be robbed. Must have been rather awkward when all the passengers continued on their journey with only the Israelis still having any possessions! ;)
I also heard that Australians were generally discarded as hostages in Colombia because they were always wearing flip-flops and so weren’t equipped for trekking days though jungle.
Tom,
Just an observation, Gil has triple citizenship, European passport, Brazilians passport and now the American passport… ;)
Ray
I´m relieved by this conversation! I thought I had read somewhere in the fine print that if you get Brazilian citizenship you have to renounce your other nationality, that is they don´t accept dual citizenship. In that situation I already decided to keep my US citizenship for many of the same reasons you list. Glad to hear that´s not the case. If it´s allowed, I think I´ll go for dual citizenship once I get my RNE (at 1 year of residency, I´m still waiting too). I´d like to vote, and I think in time I´m going to become a big ol´hybrid of cultures. Might as well have both passports to reflect the mental confusion ;)
Good point Malvina – voting is another of those things. If you don’t do it, you still feel a bit like a visitor right?
Tom,
Did it really take 2 years for your card to come through? I applied for mine in July 2012, and they told me then it would take 6 months. As of now, my protocolo expired, I had to get it extended, and still the PF system says that it has no record of my protocolo number. Appreciate your response mate.
Hey Carlos,
I think the entire process took 2 years, from filling out the first forms to actually receiving the card. When I was first given my protocolo, they also told me it would be 6 months, but in fact I waited about a year. It was a real pain having to keep returning to Galeão airport (the nearest PF office) just for them to put another stamp on the protocolo and tell me to come back in another 3 months.
I never actually checked the PF system – I heard that it existed, but one member of staff told me it wasn’t working, then another member of staff told me it was fine, but the URL he gave me didn’t work. Have patience, I’m sure yours will show up eventually. Good luck!
Wow, I’ve been following your blog for so long. That’s cool to get a response from you. Thanks for the input. It makes me a little less anxious about my process.
Ha ha! I’m very happy to respond Carlos! Thanks for following :)
I feel your pain with the immigration process, it’s a long, tedious road (to be fair, I don’t think it’s just Brazil – from what I’ve heard it seems to be like this everywhere). There were times at the start (when Mrs Eat Rio and I were going through the process required to marry) where we almost gave up. Can you believe we were told by officials more than once that what we were trying to do (get married) wasn’t possible?! Then the next person we asked would say “Sure you can do it – you just need form X and certificate Y!” There is a lot of misinformation out there and it can get very confusing/disheartening, but patience and determination win in the end!
When it comes to obtaining answers to these questions why not consult someone who deals professionally with such matters? Scroll down the link below and perhaps you will find said person, and in case you don’t ask them if they know of someone that can help you.
http://sweethomefloripa.com/category/law/
@ Tom: I received the same info about marriage not being a possibility . . . from my mother-in-law (only kidding). Seriously though: how can an official be so incompetent to the point of misinforming others in such a way.
Yeah, it’s incredibly frustrating when you are relying for people on information and they basically just don’t know or can’t be bothered to find out. It reminds me of the people working in call centres – after a while you get to recognise the sound of disinterested, underpaid, under-trained people. Once you spot them you just have to find a way of sidestepping them and getting to the people who actually know what they’re doing.
p.s. the mother-in-law joke was pretty good. Probably should have been followed with one of these though ;)
Hi, Tom!
I totally understand you! People ask me the same here in Argentina (specially because it’s so easy to get the citizenship). I have a permanent resident status and, for me, its engough. I can work, pay taxes, etc. But I don’t vote, which is actually fine. I am Brazilian and feel like only the argentines (and the foreigns that decided to build their lifes here) should vote. I will be going back to Brazil at some point and it doesn’t seem fair to make decisions on their politics (even because there could be a conflict of interests).
On the other hand, my grandparents are Portuguese and, a few years ago, sponsered the citizenship application for the whole family. Many Brazilian from European families were doing it to have a more “acceptable” passaport, live in Europe, etc. My process was never concluded and now I don’t know if I should finish it or not. I do appreciate my Portuguese past, but I don’t feel Portuguese at all. I am Brazilian! And It doesn’t look right to apply for the Portuguese Citizenship just for convinience. But, anyway, there’s something I have to decide yet… Maybe I’ll do it. Maybe not. But the Argentine one, never! =P
Hey Sthephani!
Ha ha, I like the idea of your conflict of interests when voting! Would you be tempted to do ‘sabotage voting’? Vote for the worst politicians/policies to give Brazil an advantage? ;) Hee hee, I’m just kidding rs.
I think I would be very tempted to apply for a passport that made travel/work in other countries easier. But I think I would find it hard if the new passport was for a big ‘rival’ country. I guess the equivalent of Brazil-Argentina would be Britain-Germany. I think Germany is a great country and I have nothing against Germans at all, but I’m not sure I could bring myself to ever apply for German citizenship (despite the fact that I was born there!).
hi tom. hope you are fine. can you tell me that after your first protocol . when your name show in federal police web? and when your name arrive whats you did further?
Hi Arsalan. I’m afraid I was never able to get the federal police web page to work. I heard that it is fine now, but when I was trying (a couple of years ago) it didn’t seem to work. From the time that I received my protocol to the time my RNE was ready it took about 14 months I think. I know for some people it has taken a LOT longer :( We just kept going back to the Policia Federal (at Galeão) to renew my protocol (every 3 months) and every time we asked if the RNE was ready. One time we went and got a nice surprise!
For me, it took around 5-6 months for my name to appear on the website I checked. Up until that point, it said the protocolo number was not valid. Finally it said something like it was ‘in process’, then after about 10 months total it said ready for pickup. I did everything at the DPF at Galeao. It was a really happy moment when I handed over that paper protocolo and got my cedula card…….
Oh man yeah! So good to finally get your hands on the proper card and do away with that annoying slip of paper :D
its good carlos so you have RNE now? and which web you use? for check your name?
I do have my RNE, since May 2013. I cannot remember exactly the site I used to check the status of my process, but I can tell you for sure it was a Policia Federal site.